Vista C: Loading > 1 Mapsource Map & Auto-routing

[+somainer]

I am a relative newcomer to geocaching and have been using a friend’s Garmin Vista. I love the small size, my wife likes the electronic compass, and we both like the geek factor of the mapping capability. As we are now considering purchasing a Vista C - because of the color screen (for better map reading), USB connectivity (for faster data transfer), auto-routing (for well, auto-routing, which we would occasionally like to use and think is a good addition given the limited utility of the unit for on-the-fly, large-scale route planning, in light of the smallish screen), and reportedly better battery life span and performance under tree cover (than the black-and-white Vista) - I have two questions related to the mapping capabilities of the Vista C that have arisen from my limited experience with the Vista:

 

1) Can I use more than one Mapsource map simultaneously on the Vista C? With my friend's Vista (black and white), it appears that although I can transfer more than one map data-set (e.g., “Topo US” and “Roads and Recreation”) to the GPSr, only one of the maps is used on-screen at a time (e.g., topo lines for a given area are not visible if I have also loaded the Road and Recreation data for that same area).

 

2) If I cannot use more than one map simultaneously, what is the hierarchy for map usage, how does the presence of topo data effect auto-routing, and has the interface for de-selecting maps improved (as compared to the Vista)? In particular I am troubled by the thought of paying big bucks for “Topo US” AND auto-routing enabled software (e.g., “City Select North America”), loading both into the Vista C, and not being able to use one or the other due to their “incompatibility.” And at least on the Vista that I have been playing with, de-selecting a specific map (so that another is operational) is not very user-friendly – i.,e., I have to go into the Map/Options/Setup Map/MapSource Info menu and uncheck any offending maps, based solely on their names.

 

Any input you Vista C veterans can provide would be greatly appreciated.

[+Renegade Knight]

Yes you can load more than one map. City Select is 'on top' so you have to turn it off to see topo. If you try to autoroute with Topo visable it does goofy things (I'm told this is because it tries to use the base map for auto routing). Turn back on the City Select maps to route. I've never tried to use more than City Select and Topo as it's pretty much the best of both worlds.

 

It's as simple as that.

 

Ok maybe not as simple. MY GPS V can easily swith between maps. Other Garmins can't do it as easily. Hopefully they can fix it on a firmware update.

Edited September 18, 2005 by Renegade Knight

[peter]

And at least on the Vista that I have been playing with, de-selecting a specific map (so that another is operational) is not very user-friendly – i.,e., I have to go into the Map/Options/Setup Map/MapSource Info menu and uncheck any offending maps, based solely on their names.

Don't have a Vista handy right now, but I believe you also have the option of clicking on the Menu icon again at that point and getting choices like "Select All", "Select MetroGuide", "Select Topo", "Select None", etc.

 

No need to select or deselect each individual map.

[+hogrod]

I have to go into the Map/Options/Setup Map/MapSource Info menu and uncheck any offending maps, based solely on their names.

 

Don't have a Vista handy right now, but I believe you also have the option of clicking on the Menu icon again at that point and getting choices like "Select All", "Select MetroGuide", "Select Topo", "Select None", etc. 

 

he is right, i tried this and took me awhile to find it exactly. without using any short cut keys, goto: main menu, setup, map, now highlight the map information button and hit the menu/find key. now you will have more options for your map.

the shorter way is at the map screen hit the menu/find key, highlight mapsetup and hit enter, now highlight mapsetup information & hit the menu/find key.

 

Edited September 18, 2005 by hogrod

[+the hermit crabs]

As we are now considering purchasing a Vista C -  because of the color screen (for better map reading), USB connectivity (for faster data transfer), auto-routing (for well, auto-routing, which we would occasionally like to use and think is a good addition given the limited utility of the unit for on-the-fly, large-scale route planning, in light of the smallish screen), and reportedly better battery life span and performance under tree cover (than the black-and-white Vista) - I have two questions related to the mapping capabilities of the Vista C that have arisen from my limited experience with the Vista.

Others have already answered your mapping question, but regarding your other expectations: you are right -- the screen, the performance under tree cover, transfer speed, and battery life are all noticeably better on the Vista C. This thread from last month lists some other differences between the black-and-white Vista and the Vista C.

[+apersson850]

I think that the only thing that's better in the Vista, compared to the Vista C, is the basemap. Since the Vista basemap isn't routeable, it has more detail (they both require 8 MB of memory).

[+somainer]

Thanks to all for your prompt and helpful replies.

 

I pulled out the Vista (black and white) and peter’s suggestion does indeed work. I just never new it existed, as this capability is not mentioned in the Vista manual at all - or even that this menu sequence exists. For comparison, I downloaded a copy of the Vista C manual, and the feature is listed there (page 60). Interestingly, the manual for the Vista C, but not for the Vista, also states the following (page 86): "You cannot view multiple types of MapSource data in the same location at the same time (one displays over the other)... Maps that are at the top of the hierarchy and [sic] displays over any other information. Because new maps are constantly being released, consult your Garmin dealer or the Garmin website to determine the order of hierarchy." I briefly searched www.garmin.com but found no reference to map hierarchies. But based upon my own observations of the performance of the Vista (black and white), and those by Renegade Knight of the GPS V, it appears that the “Topo US” is not “on top” by default.

 

All this info leads to two additional follow-up questions:

 

1) Pretend I hop in the car to hit a cache, with both the “Topo US” and “City Select North America” map data-sets for a given area loaded in to the Vista C. If I want help figuring out a driving route and try to use the auto-routing feature, will the Vista C by default use the “City Select North America” data-set or will I have to temporarily “disable” the “Topo US” data via the steps others described in order for the auto-routing to work?

 

2) After I am at the trailhead, obviously I will notice if there are no contour lines visible on-screen (if “Topo US” is not loaded “on top”), and could relatively easily re-“enable” the “Topo US” data and “disable” the City Select north America” data using the step folks have outlined. But after I have returned to my car and want to use auto-routing to find a possible driving route to the next cache, will the Vista C utilize the “City Select North America” data, even though I had previously “disabled” it? If not, will I get some notification screen or prompt so that I will remember to re-“enable” that data-set, or will the Vista C utilize some lower-detail basemap?

 

Thanks in advance for any additional feedback Vista C users might have based on their experience with the model. I am still leaning towards purchasing a Vista C, but am curious about these usability issues - particulalry before I invest in the pricey maps.

Edited September 18, 2005 by somainer

[+Renegade Knight]

If you load both City Select and Topo maps into your GPS. They are both turned 'on' by default. Your GPS will only display City Select.

 

To see topo you have to turn off the city Select maps. That's what you will do at the trail head. When you get back to the trail head after your hike and you want the closest fast food. You will need to turn back on the City Select maps. Then you can autoroute. If you forget and autoroute your GPS will (I'm told) use the basemap. Since the basmap has only major roads, it will seem like it's acting strange.

 

You only need to turn off and on City Select. The reason is that City Select gets 'priority' in that when it's on, it's all you see. It overides topo.

 

This is how my GPS V works. Others should be similar but YMMV.

[+Sputnik 57]

Thanks to all for your prompt and helpful replies.

 

I pulled out the Vista (black and white) and peter’s suggestion does indeed work. I just never new it existed, as this capability is not mentioned in the Vista manual at all - or even that this menu sequence exists.

It took me a while to figure it out too.

 

It's discussed in question 9 of the Maps Section of the FAQ.

 

Another discussion is here. I think that one address your issue.

[+somainer]

Another discussion is here.  I think that one address your issue.

 

Sputnik, your previous comments on the usability issue of map switching hit the nail on the head! It really doesn't make much sense for a unit like the Vista C, or any others which have obvious utility in both the trail and car, to be so user-unfriendly from the stanpdoint of map management. When I use the auto-routing feature, I don't want to have to first check which maps are currenlty loaded or unloaded (e.g., if I forget to turn the City Select maps back "on", after having turned them off in order to see the contour lines from the Topo US dataset, it sounds like by deafult the auto-routing will use the lower quality basemap). ugh! but I guess i will have to learn to deal with it - as I really llike the suite of other features for the unit and thus just went ahead and ordered a Vista C.

 

But a logical feature to add in a firmware/software update would be another option in the "Routing Setup Page" called something like "Map query," with options of either "No" or "Prompted," that would function like the current "Guidance method" field. If you were to leave the hypothetical "Map query" field on the default "No," then the unit could operate as it currently does - i.e., your auto-routing would be based on whatever maps you had loaded and previously turned on or off. But if you select "Prompted" then you would get a prompt whenever you choose to auto-route which would ask you which map to use....

 

As an aside, have you found any formal doucmentation from Garmin which explicitly outlines the mapping hierarchy? A number of folks in various threads have commented on the apparent hierarchies they have observed on their units, but I have yet to see a documented source.