Proposed New (old) Cache Type

[markandlynn]

I know the subject of giving the original stash a unique icon has been brought up before but did anyone considered expanding this concept.

 

Places like ex project ape sites, first traditional cache in a country, first multi etc could be given a historic cache site icon. These could be new caches placed at these locations with links to the original cache page.

 

It would be a great way to remember the pioneers of geocaching and the caches they placed.

 

I would guess a way to administer this would be for the local approvers to refer upwards or sideways any proposed historic caches for peer review agreement.

 

This would give icon hunters a physical cache to seek and would avoid the issues with say ape caches only being available in one (two now!!) countries.

 

If this has been discussed before appologies.

[+The Leprechauns]

It would make a nice cache *attribute* and I would support that if there are simple standards for one to qualify. But it's still a puzzle cache, a traditional cache, a multicache, etc.

 

Now that we can search on attributes, you could find all of these caches using a pocket query, and even regular members would notice them when viewing the cache page.

[+HoPri]

I agree that this would be a nice attribute. One for which I assume that there would be many supporters...

 

Then, what about a general lost place attribute? We could have both - the historic attribute for places that are still intact or in regular use, and lost place for those places that are in decay and rather forgotten?

 

Best regards,

HoPri

 

Edit: smilies...

 

PS: On a serious side-note, those attributes would make sense if "historic" is in general context and not only geocaching.

Edited December 2, 2005 by HoPri

[+tozainamboku]

Why not just start a bookmark list of 'Historic geocaches'. Start a thread in the geocaching topics forum where people can discuss the caches that should go in this list. When a consensus is reached, add the cache to the bookmarklist. If there are more then 100 -- hopefully by then, Jeremy will have increased the number of caches that can be in a bookmark list.

[+Moose Mob]

I have to agree that the Original Stash Plaque having it's own unique icon has a lot of appeal. Kind of like historical markers along the highway. Like others, I am perplexed as to what other locations would share this type of significance. First cache in each state/country? Is a plaque reqiired to qualify?

 

Otherwise, I have to agree with the guy in the white coat. Attributes can fit some of these, or possibly Waymarks?

[+The Leprechauns]

I have to agree that the Original Stash Plaque having it's own unique icon has a lot of appeal. Kind of like historical markers along the highway. Like others, I am perplexed as to what other locations would share this type of significance. First cache in each state/country? Is a plaque reqiired to qualify?

 

Otherwise, I have to agree with the guy in the white coat. Attributes can fit some of these, or possibly Waymarks?

I am wearing my furry hamster costume in this thread, not my lab coat.

 

"First cache in the Country/Province/State" seems easy at first blush. But nothing's simple in geocaching. Do we say oldest active cache (which may change if an old cache is archived) or the very first cache, even if archived? What if that archived cache really ought to remain a bit of a hidden secret? There are several states where the oldest cache was hidden without permission and was removed by the land manager, such as the National Park Service in my neighboring states of Ohio and West Virginia. Do we go by the "date hidden," as listed by the owner, or by the date listed on Geocaching.com or its predecessor listserv? The answer to that question dictates which is the oldest active cache in my home State of Pennsylvania.

[+Moose Mob]

Oops, I seem to have trouble keeping up with all of your personalities.

 

The first cache in Nevada was along a riverbank and was washed down stream in it's first rainy season. Not sure what could be done. Perhaps somewhere nearby?

 

Oldest active cache in a territory? Seem too dynamic. What if the cache gets archived. Do we pick a different location? Folks would lose the icon and a new cache would need to be identified and changed to that catagory?

 

What other historic location would there be with regards to geocaching? Groundspeak HQ? Jeremy's birthplace? The first cache published by your local reviewer?

[+geognerd]

Do we go by the "date hidden," as listed by the owner, or by the date listed on Geocaching.com or its predecessor listserv?

I thought there was a cache in New England where someone faked the "date hidden," setting it as far back as it could go on the Edit Cache page.

[+The Leprechauns]

Do we go by the "date hidden," as listed by the owner, or by the date listed on Geocaching.com or its predecessor listserv?

I thought there was a cache in New England where someone faked the "date hidden," setting it as far back as it could go on the Edit Cache page.

Yes, there are many examples of that. Look at Dave Ulmer's cache pages sometime. A real shame that the history was lost.

 

So it is not that easy to identify the oldest cache in a state, province or country.

[markandlynn]

I would say that we leave the is it or isnt it historic to have a cache at the location to the reviewer they can see the other caches that were nearby etc.

If the reviewer agrees he passes it onto another reviewer to concurr.

I would expect there to be not very many and they would be sites you make a "pilgrimage" to unless you are by chance nearby or have allready visited one.

[+The Leprechauns]

Well, if I changed clothes, I'd be in my reviewer costume, and I'm tellin' ya, if there are subjective standards to be invoked in order to determine whether a cache is "historic," then thanks anyways, but I catch enough flames as it is. Defining "historic" could be like defining "Wow! factor." So please tell me what the criteria are, thanks.

 

Also, I wouldn't dream of going onto someone else's cache page and adding a cache attribute without the cache owner's consent or an express authorization from Groundspeak to do so.

[+Moose Mob]

I think markandlynn had the right idea for a place to start. What location would be worthy of a pilgramage. Note the subtle differences in the definition differences between "pilgramage" and "road trip".

 

And I almost never wear my reviewer costume here, so it saves on confusion.

[+The Leprechauns]

"My cache is worthy of a pilgrimage. Why won't you award my cache the attribute?"

 

"Uhhh, I looked at your cache. It's a terrain 1 in a nice suburban park. No offense, but it's not exactly the Project APE cache in Brazil."

 

"But my handicapped kid hid this cache on his seventh birthday. It's very special. We had an event cache to celebrate."

 

"Sorry, but after checking with the appeals board for historic cache designations, the answer is still no."

 

"Geocaching.com hates handicapped chinldren."

[+Jamie Z]

Geocaching.com hates handicapped chinldren.

 

That's crazy talk. Nobody would every say that.

Edited December 2, 2005 by Jamie Z

[+The Leprechauns]

I was speaking hypothetically. I worry about such things. I have a very negative attitude.

 

[+tozainamboku]

Also, I wouldn't dream of going onto someone else's cache page and adding a cache attribute without the cache owner's consent or an express authorization from Groundspeak to do so.

But you could make a bookmark list and make it public and shareable so the list shows up on the cache page without the owner's consent .

 

If markandlynn want to recognize historic caches they can create a bookmark list. If they want they could start a thread to ask for suggestions for caches to add to the list.

Edited December 2, 2005 by tozainamboku

[+The Leprechauns]

A bookmark list would be cool. Or lots of them. "Historic caches of the UK." "Oldest Active Cache in each Canadian Province." There's already a good one to collect all the active and archived Project APE caches.

 

Bookmark lists are an established site feature. In my earlier post, I merely pointed out the need for Groundspeak' approval of a historic cache attribute as an established site feature. Just as there is whinging about an "unwelcome" bookmark list link being displayed on a cache page, I am anticipating whinging about an "unwelcome" cache attribute being displayed on a cache page. And I merely wish to insulate myself from additional whinging, especially when directed at my sock puppet.

Edited December 2, 2005 by The Leprechauns

[+budd-rdc]

I agree that a shared bookmark list is the best solution right now.

 

There's a starting point for a "historic" icon or attribute (I prefer attribute): Active caches with three or four letter waypoints (GCx, GCxx) become eligible for the attribute. Some five letter ones (GCxxx) and a few six letter ones (GCFFFF or before) could become eligible, too, especially if they are the oldest in their respective states or country. A cut-off date would need to be considered, too (December 31, 2002?)

 

I smell bureaucracy from implementing this feature though, so it's not something I'd want urgently.

[+Lil Devil]

Start here.

[+StarBrand]

Some public bookmark lists of these would be neat. First in Country, First in State, First in County. Maybe even the first 10.

[+Harry Dolphin]

If one wanted to create new icons for historic caches, I would suggest a set of historic icons for for all active caches hidden in 2001 (and before, if any). Or, 'All Caches Older than Four Years Of Age', updated in December of each year. That would give us an added incentive to hunt for the historical caches. I think I've found a few of them.

[+budd-rdc]

Start here.

Thanks for the link.

[+Snoogans]

"My cache is worthy of a pilgrimage. Why won't you award my cache the attribute?"

 

"Uhhh, I looked at your cache. It's a terrain 1 in a nice suburban park. No offense, but it's not exactly the Project APE cache in Brazil."

 

"But my handicapped kid hid this cache on his seventh birthday. It's very special. We had an event cache to celebrate."

 

"Sorry, but after checking with the appeals board for historic cache designations, the answer is still no."

 

"Geocaching.com hates handicapped chinldren."

Rather than award for aesthetic reasons, why not have a cache attribute that is unselectable for 5 years. At which time the owner can choose to change ther icon if they want.

[+Snoogans]

If one wanted to create new icons for historic caches, I would suggest a set of historic icons for for all active caches hidden in 2001

How about a charter cache icon separate and unique from cache longevity icons?

 

This might be an incentive to reactivate/adopt some old caches if they don't violate the .1 rule.

[+CO Admin]

This whole thread sounds like a good use of Waymarking.

[+CO Admin]

dupe post, OOPS

Edited December 3, 2005 by CO Admin

[markandlynn]

OK ive started a bookmark list of historic caches.

Shall add the ones from the link above but that will take a while

Any correction / nominations etc ?

the only split i may make at this stage is between active and archived.

It would be nice if eventually these caches were assigned a unique icon by Groundspeak to recognize there status

[markandlynn]

Finally tracked down the old thread on the original cache plaque icon.

The icon proposed was this one.

 

The thread also mentions the proliferation of coin icons and icon hounds wanting all icons

[Trinity's Crew]

So what's wrong with icon hounds? Or numbers hounds? Or prolific forum posters?It's funny how some people can make anything sound like a bad thing. It's a GAME! It's supposed to be fun.

 

I think a unique icon for the cache plaque would be great, but I don't think I'll ever get there to log it.

 

I agree that trying to designate other caches that deserve a "historic" icon might become a nightmare.

 

Edit: Added last thought

Edited December 9, 2005 by Trinity's Crew

[+Moose Mob]

Finally tracked down the old thread on the original cache plaque icon.

The icon proposed was this one.

 

The thread also mentions the proliferation of coin icons and icon hounds wanting all icons

Cool!

 

Which other locations would warrant the designation of an important location with regards to geocaching? Keep in mind that these would be places that many folks would want to make a "pilgrimage" to. (Yes, make it a special icon like the APE caches and folks will pilgramage to it)

 

- Dave Ulmer's original cache location

- Groundspeak HQ

- Jeremy's house

[+Snoogans]

So what's wrong with icon hounds? Or numbers hounds? Or prolific forum posters?It's funny how some people can make anything sound like a bad thing. It's a GAME! It's supposed to be fun.

 

WORD!

 

"Everyone plays their own game. There is no sense in trying to police another's mindset as long as it falls within the general parameters of the game." Me (quoting myself from the poll that I posted on 10/23/03.)

[CoyoteRed]

So what's wrong with icon hounds? Or numbers hounds? Or prolific forum posters?It's funny how some people can make anything sound like a bad thing. It's a GAME! It's supposed to be fun.

 

WORD!

 

"Everyone plays their own game. There is no sense in trying to police another's mindset as long as it falls within the general parameters of the game." Me (quoting myself from the poll that I posted on 10/23/03.)

How does vying for certain icons fall within the parameters of the hobby? The icons are a function of this site, not part of the game.

 

It's the same with the find count. The way the function of the site is build "find count" has nothing to do with the number of caches you've found, only the number of "Found It" logs you've written. The reason for writting that log can include, in some folks' minds anyway, could be for things other than finding a cache. (See other thread.)

 

The problem is these outside influences affect the hobby and some think in a negative way. I would figure anything that affects the hobby in a negative way falls outside the general parameters of how it should be pursued.