Exact coordinates

[+clayton994]

Hi all...

 

I'm totally new to this so please forgive me if my question sounds stupid. I've noticed that each cache has a description page which has the coordinates of the cache near the top of the page. However, sometimes there's a puzzle to work out the exact coordinates of the cache. Are the coordinates at the top of the description page just rough ones to get you started, but not necessarily the exact coordinates of the cache; or are the puzzles simply something extra for geocache enthusiasts which, once solved, give the same coordinates as the ones already listed at the top of the description page?

 

Another question, which is really the same as the first question I guess - I've loaded a .kml file onto Google Earth which shows the location of caches around the world. Are the locations shown on Google Earth (which use the same coordinates as the ones given on the description page for each cache) accurate enough for me to find the cache, or do I need to do more work to get more accurate coordinates?

 

FYI - I don't even own a GPS or smart phone, but I like to explore Google Earth at home on my desktop. Today I noted the locations of a number of caches on Google Earth and went to look for them. I found two, but not the third. I wasn't sure whether the location of the one I couldn't find was a little off, or whether I just wasn't looking hard enough. I guess if I want to get into this I really need to invest in a GPS device!

 

Thanks,

Clayton

[+Bear and Ragged]

Hi all...

 

I'm totally new to this so please forgive me if my question sounds stupid. I've noticed that each cache has a description page which has the coordinates of the cache near the top of the page. However, sometimes there's a puzzle to work out the exact coordinates of the cache. Are the coordinates at the top of the description page just rough ones to get you started, but not necessarily the exact coordinates of the cache; or are the puzzles simply something extra for geocache enthusiasts which, once solved, give the same coordinates as the ones already listed at the top of the description page?

 

Thanks,

Clayton

 

Puzzle caches (Unknown Caches) the coordinates are 'Bogus' and can be up to 2 miles/3km from where the cache actually is. (BUT. There may be a puzzle cache that the cache IS at the coordinates!)

 

Multi-caches, the coordinates at the top of the page are usually for the first stage of the cache.

[+clayton994]

 

Puzzle caches (Unknown Caches) the coordinates are 'Bogus' and can be up to 2 miles/3km from where the cache actually is. (BUT. There may be a puzzle cache that the cache IS at the coordinates!)

 

Multi-caches, the coordinates at the top of the page are usually for the first stage of the cache.

 

Thanks Bear and Ragged. That makes sense now - the cache I couldn't find was a puzzle cache!

[+The Blorenges]

... and as for looking at the locations on Google Maps, yes, they'll give you a good indication of traditional cache locations (the ones that aren't Unknown/Puzzles or Multi-caches). But sometimes Google Maps can be out by quite a bit, maybe 20 - 100ft, so that's why you need to have some sort of GPS to get reliable co-ordinates when hiding a cache. When searching, if the cache setter has got good coordinates, you should still expect to search around a 20 - 30 radius of "Ground Zero".

 

MrsB

[+kunarion]

Puzzle caches (also called Mystery or Unknown) may be very devious. The "real" coordinates could be hidden in a multitude of ways.

 

If you use Google Earth, and can zoom into the map close enough, you may see a fence or tree or other structure that the container's hidden in, and use landmarks as a reference (as Mrs B says, it depends on the hider's coordinates). A forest of trees usually won't work as well, using this method. The satellite map photos aren't always aligned perfectly. Hunt some caches, and see how well it works in your area. It might be just fine.

Edited June 3, 2012 by kunarion

[+clayton994]

Thanks kunarion & Mrs. B.

 

That's a great help. Since the cache I couldn't find was a puzzle cache, it's little wonder that the location on Google Earth wasn't much help, and the description of the area didn't really fit. I have no idea about how to solve the puzzle though, but I guess that's another problem again. As I get into it more, I should get better at recognizing the types of puzzles that are given, but at least I know not to spend too much time looking for that cache until I work out the solution to the puzzle which is a great help.

 

Thanks all!

Clayton

[+Chief301]

There are a couple of ways that a Puzzle cache is done. One, the coordinates listed are totally bogus (i.e., there's nothing at that location...it might be in the middle of a lake or something) and you have to solve a puzzle or look up some information described on the cache page to figure out the true coordinates. Another type is one where you do actually have to go to the listed coordinates and obtain some information (date from a historic marker, number of benches in the park, etc.) and use that information to decipher the puzzle described on the cache page. Then there are some others where the coordinates will bring you right to the container but you have to solve a puzzle to get a combination to unlock it or something along those lines.

 

Usually the cache page will state "The cache is NOT at the listed coordinates!" if that is the case. But sometimes not.

 

Some puzzles are really simple...look up or obtain some info and use that to "fill in the blanks" of the missing cache coordinate digits. I have the coordinates saved for a few caches in Baton Rouge where I only had to research some info on the internet (jersey numbers of former LSU athletes, birthdates, stuff like that) to fill in the blanks...Not very hard, just time comsuming, but I haven't had the chance to go find the finals yet. Others are very devious and it's not obvious exactly what you need to figure out to get the info. Then there are some that you just have to decipher something...I have one I'm still trying to figure out that is in Vigenere cypher (a code used by the Confederacy in the Civil War) and another that uses a form of Freemason cypher. First you have to figure out what you're looking at before you can figure out how to decipher it

[+clayton994]

Thanks for the tips Dave. Actually, I worked out the puzzle overnight - it was a word search puzzle and I've already solved it to get the true coordinates (which were some distance from the original 'bogus' coordinates as expected).... so I *will* return to that cache next time I'm in the area (it was out-of town)!

 

Thanks again,

Clayton

[+Chief301]

I'm going to have to get rid of that Dave Barry quote in my tagline....that's the second time someone calls me Dave...

[+Markwell]

And the KML is something different. There's a built-in fudge-factor on the KML for the GoogleViewer

 

http://www.geocaching.com/about/google.aspx

Please Note: The coordinates used in Google Earth are only an approximation and can be up to 100 ft from the actual location. The Geocaching Google Earth feature is a tool for viewing geocaches in a general location. Do not use the coordinates in Google Earth for finding or placing geocaches.

 

But if you use Pocket Queries and load the GPX file directly into Google Earth, that limitation goes away. Then, any traditional cache should be at the location of the marker on the map.

 

Just to illustrate this - here's a traditional cache shows in three different refreshes of the Google Earth KML viewer for Geocaching.com:

 

Refresh 1:

 

Refresh 2:

 

Refresh 3:

 

Here's the same cache using the GPX file loaded into Google Earth:

 

As you can see, it's not exactly where ANY of the three early KML images show it. But the GPX is spot on.

 

Here's a zoom in:

 

Guess what? The cache is just by the northwest corner of a culvert bridge. That marker is RIGHT where the cache is - I wouldn't have needed a GPS.

 

BUT WAIT - THERE'S MORE

I'm lucky - the Chicago area's images are pretty spot on for matching the image to the latitude/longitude coordinates - usually within feet, definitely within tolerance of what a GPS would give me. But there are some areas that are off for the images by several hundred feet. So depending on your area, even if you use the GPX file, you may or may not get an accurate idea of the location.

 

AND - as was said earlier - the only types of caches that this will work for are events and traditional caches. All others, you need to read the cache page to figure out just what to do to get to the location.

 

Hope this gives you an idea of the limitations (and rare benefits) of using Google Earth as your only means for caching. Best to have a GPS along.

Edited June 4, 2012 by Markwell
bad typing

[jholly]

I'm going to have to get rid of that Dave Barry quote in my tagline....that's the second time someone calls me Dave...

Why Dave, that is a good quote .....