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Garmin 62 trip odometer question


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Here's the problem I am having with this new unit....

 

Let's say bicycle from point A to B, 62s does great in recording the correct distance on the trip odometer. Then I turn off the GPS to go back to point A to record the ride stats

 

However the problem is when I turn back on the unit at point A, it's adding a straight line distance from point B to A almost doubling the distance on the trip odometer, making it quite a pain to use that feature.

 

This was not a problem with my Venture HC, Etrex 10, or Dakota 10.

 

I guess my question is has anyone else had this problem and if so, is there a selection setting on the 62s that would make the unit stop doing this.

Edited by gpsblake
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Forgive me if I'm just not clear on the specifics regarding your issue here.

 

Couldn't you just clear the tracklog before you begin again at point "A".? The GPS is taking your last known track point, at point "B", and is using that point as your starting point. So then unit just draws a straight line between where you turned it off to where you turned it back on, presumably at point "A".

 

When you get back to point A is there a reason why you couldn't just clear the current tracklog and then begin recording your track?

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Let me be more specific... I ride my bike from my home to Point B.... 12.5 miles total riding...

 

I get back to my house to record those stats but when I repower back on the unit, it will immediately add the distance as the crow flies from Point B back to my house on the trip computer. Thus by the time I get to the trip computer screen to enter my stats, it will say 24.0 miles for the trip computer the moment the unit gets a lock, which is very quick even within my house. even the track will be flawed because it will show a straight line back to my house, thus making me EDIT the gpx file to get it to work right with mapmyride.com.

 

The other units I mentioned never did this before.

 

I am reading it's been a issue on other units like the Montana. It is not an issue with the Edge series, which uses the same family of firmware. Some with the Montana problem said to roll back the firmware to an older version.

 

Other then this issue, the 62s is a great unit, by far the best I have ever own when it comes to accuracy, load up speed, etc....

Edited by gpsblake
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Your other units were not sensitive enough to pick up satellite signal in your house. That is the "problem" you are having. Solution: use your track data to grab stats instead. Should the unit record your new location before going into mass-storage mode, you can always delete those points from the track.

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If you are using the track log , that is normal. You need to turn the track log off after you finish your trip leg, otherwise where ever you are later, when you turn the gps back on, a straight line will be drawn from where you now are to your last point, where you finished your trip.

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=316935&st=0&p=5317001&hl=tracklog&fromsearch=1entry5317001

Maybe you may find some use full info in the above post,if not, just do a search for others posts.

Edited by Forkeye
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Let's say bicycle from point A to B, 62s does great in recording the correct distance on the trip odometer. Then I turn off the GPS to go back to point A to record the ride stats

 

However the problem is when I turn back on the unit at point A, it's adding a straight line distance from point B to A almost doubling the distance on the trip odometer, making it quite a pain to use that feature.

I've had this problem with my OR 450 and there are two solutions, assuming your 62 has the same base code as the OR:

  1. Revert to an earlier firmware that terminates the track with a power cycle. With my 450 that was v5.5. No free lunch here, v5.5 doesn't allow later gadgets like the Tempe.
  2. Go to Setup > Tracks > Auto Archive and set Daily. Again not perfect, two trips in the same day will still get the connecting line. You'll need to manually terminate the track as described in an earlier post.

I realize you asked about the trip odo, it's controlled by the track function.

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Thanks for the suggestions, but it is a bug in my opinion. Just to prove this, I just rode my car about 9 miles away, carrying my Dakota 10, Venture HC, and 62s. Went for a small walk about .2 mile here at my house. Turned off the units (all had .23 or .24 miles traveled). Turned back on the units at the store.... Once the 60s got a lock my trip odometer instantly went up from .24 to 9.64 while the other two units remained at .23 miles even after their locks.... I know the Dakota and Venture will divide track logs into different segments each time the unit is turned off. The 62s apparently does not to do this, it does not auto-segment the tracks, thus automatically think you just went 9 miles instantly.

 

Perhaps playing with track settings can help solve this.

Edited by gpsblake
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Let's say bicycle from point A to B, 62s does great in recording the correct distance on the trip odometer. Then I turn off the GPS to go back to point A to record the ride stats

 

However the problem is when I turn back on the unit at point A, it's adding a straight line distance from point B to A almost doubling the distance on the trip odometer, making it quite a pain to use that feature.

I've had this problem with my OR 450 and there are two solutions, assuming your 62 has the same base code as the OR:

  1. Revert to an earlier firmware that terminates the track with a power cycle. With my 450 that was v5.5. No free lunch here, v5.5 doesn't allow later gadgets like the Tempe.
  2. Go to Setup > Tracks > Auto Archive and set Daily. Again not perfect, two trips in the same day will still get the connecting line. You'll need to manually terminate the track as described in an earlier post.

I realize you asked about the trip odo, it's controlled by the track function.

 

The trip odometer (all readings in the trip computer) are not controlled by the track, rather the track samples points from the trip computer, or possibly records them independently. This is an issue that, when you turn on your GPS, the trip odometer begins collecting information before you've actually achieved satellite lock, so that once it does get a reading, it reads the move from your last position. To re-iterate, it's not that big of a deal if you use the track to get your data instead of transcribing it by hand from the trip computer. You can save your track at the end of of your trip, or trim your track later in basecamp. Even if you do save, you might want to clean up your track anyway to account for errors and the "wandering" or "birds-nest" effect of tracking while you're not moving. The trip odometer does take this into account, so if you stop and take a break, your trip computer is likely to report a longer distance travelled than you actually went.

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Even if you do save, you might want to clean up your track anyway to account for errors and the "wandering" or "birds-nest" effect of tracking while you're not moving. The trip odometer does take this into account, so if you stop and take a break, your trip computer is likely to report a longer distance travelled than you actually went.

 

Actually the 62s, Dakota, etrex 10, and Venture HC are very good about not recording distance on the odometer when standing still, if you notice a Trip Computer feature is Total time, Moving time, and Stopped time. When it's recording stopped time, the trip odometer will not record distance even though the track might be spidering out. Garmin's with mature firmware have always been good about that. I know this because I often turn on my GPS outside, go inside to finish up things before my ride, and when I go back out 30 minutes later, the trip odometer might have read 30 feet moved with a moving time of a few seconds. In other words, it has no effect on my moving average speed.

 

Could be a bug , let's say I drive my car and ride my bike for a 12 mile loop, then turn off GPS. The next day I would drive my car to a different spot, turn on my GPS.. Rather then start the odometer off at 12 miles, the odometer will add in the distance I drive from the last time I turned off the GPS to when I turned it back on. So let's say I drive 100 miles to my next bike ride. It will add the 100 miles to the trip and main odometer. It's not a huge deal but it's just something that the 62s is doing.

 

I guess for some, it would be a feature, an example would be driving through a tunnel where the GPS loses lock, but when you exit the tunnel, the GPS adds the straight line distance you drove through the tunnel thus making it more accurate in that way.

 

It's a bug I can live with..... I like to see Garmin allow us the ability to zero out the main odometer or enter figures in the odometer like the Garmin Edge allows. I think Garmin denies us that feature on purpose as like I said, the Edge shares the same family of firmware as the Oregon, Dakota, 62 and 78 series.

 

As far as the track, I am just going to save the track when I am done with my bike ride.

 

Anyhow, thanks to all who responded to my rant.

Edited by gpsblake
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I don't know that it's a bug as opposed to a deliberate feature. I've heard rumors that this behavior was intentional. At the same time, the track log would also include these jumps when it hadn't previously. I really wish Garmin would introduce an option to record the track while the trip computer recognizes the device as "moving" and stop recording when it is "stopped." Theoretically, setting the track record method to "auto" should do this, but it still records wandering movements when stopped.

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gpsblake,

See if your firmware is similar to the one on my Etrex 20. If it is, you are good to go. Turning off your GPSr at the end of your trip creates a segment. Turning it on when you get home, go to the Track Manager, then Current Track and choose: Save Portion (not Save Track.) Choose the first segment which will be your bike ride A to B.

 

One advantage of this is if you forget to save the track at the end of your trip, and just turn off your GPSr. Another advantage of this method is a multi-day trip. Turn your GPSr off at end of day, then on next day and you can save each day as a separate segment and/or the save the whole trip of multiple segments. And see the totals each day.

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Thanks for the suggestions, but it is a bug in my opinion.

I agree, but this issue has been discussed for years and Garmin either won't admit or won't solve the issue. Hence the two work-a rounds I suggested. Good Luck with Garmin. ;)

Yeah this problem may be reaching the triple digits on forum topics. Doesn't appear that Garmin thinks it is a bub.

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The "fix" for this is that when you first turn on your GPS in a different location from where you turned it off, take a few steps after you get a signal, then clear the trip computer before you start your trip.

 

For post-trip stats, use the track to grab them.

Edited by mineral2
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The "fix" for this is that when you first turn on your GPS in a different location from where you turned it off, take a few steps after you get a signal, then clear the trip computer before you start your trip.

 

The problem with I have with that is this... When I get home, I like to record my stats from the Trip Computer on my spreadsheet. However, within seconds of turning on the unit, the trip computer stats are wrong, not only the trip odometer changes but the average moving MPH also, you can barely see it in my video, but it jumped from 9.2 mph to 18.0 mph average moving speed within seconds of turning on the unit.

 

It also makes the odometer completely useless because while I can reset the Trip odometer, you can not reset the main Odometer without doing a hard reset.

 

It's a weird problem because the Dakota, which uses the same family of firmware doesn't have this problem. I saw the 64 series continues with this.... I've never tested an Oregon.

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The Oregon has this issue too, at least with the 450/550 models and newer. I suspect that the Dakota doesn't have this problem because it hasn't received a full firmware upgrade in a long time, wheras the Oregons and 62's have had some extra functionality added to them in the last year or so. The main odometer is useless. It just tracks how far your GPS has travelled. The idea is that the GPS is trying to account for movement even when the unit is turned off, but it can only calculate the direct distance between the new point and the last known point.

 

If you really need to use the trip odometer to record your stats, keep a notepad in your car and write them down after your trip, or enter them into your smartphone if you have one.

 

Or, and I can't emphasize this enough, record the track. The stats will be slightly different than the trip odometer, but depending on how you record your track, they can be closer to reality. Not only can you retrieve your stats to record in your spreadsheet, but you'll have a host of more detailed data about your trip to play with.

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The solution consists simply in switching the 62 off at the end of the hike. Then, once you get home, DO NOT switch the 62 back on. Just stick it into your computer. It will turn on, but it will not acquire a satellite position, and so, it will not add spurious points at the end of the track.

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There is another thread on this forum that deals with the same problem on the 64s. I can't believe that Garmin won't acknowledge the problem.

 

It's not really a problem. Once home, just stick it into your computer before switching it on. It will switch on automatically, but it will not add spurious points at the end of the track.

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It's not really a problem. Once home, just stick it into your computer before switching it on. It will switch on automatically, but it will not add spurious points at the end of the track.

 

We shouldn't be having to do with for one and two, we don't always turn on a computer before using the unit again. It wasn't a problem with units like the Dakota, Venture HC, Etrex C, or even the original Etrex.

 

It's a regression bug and it's a big deal to many of us who u se our units for something other then geocaching.

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It's not really a problem. Once home, just stick it into your computer before switching it on. It will switch on automatically, but it will not add spurious points at the end of the track.

 

We shouldn't be having to do with for one and two, we don't always turn on a computer before using the unit again. It wasn't a problem with units like the Dakota, Venture HC, Etrex C, or even the original Etrex.

 

It's a regression bug and it's a big deal to many of us who u se our units for something other then geocaching.

 

But I just don't think it's a bug.

Switching the GPS off != saying that a track is finished.

 

What if in a long backpacking trip, I want to switch the GPS off every night? Not because I switch it off do I want to lose the trip odometer; I may just want to pick up again on the same trip odometer when I switch it back on.

 

How would you propose otherwise that one records a long track on a multi-day trip, or even a trip where I switch the GPS off during lunch?

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gpsblake, I thought more about it.

 

Assume you bike from A to B.

Then you switch the GPS off, go back to A.

At A, you turn the GPS on.

 

I can see how the following behaviors can be implemented:

 

1) (what happens now) the point at A is considered part of the same track, and causes the trip odometer to be incremented to close to double the distance A-B (because this is A-B-A).

 

2) The GPS sees that it woke up in a point far away from where it was shut off, and starts a new track with a new track log. Great, but in this case also the trip odometer would read 0. You would have to dig into the previous tracks to display that track and its statistics.

 

3) The GPS sees that it woke up in a point far away from where it was shut off, and starts a new track with a new track log. The trip odometer consists in the sum of the track lengths, WITHOUT including the straight-line segments from the end of one track to the beginning of the next.

 

It is 3) that I think we want, right?

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But here's the best part about using the track: You can edit it. If you end up with multiple trips on one track, you can break it apart. You can delete points in the middle that aren't part any particular trip. If you're hiking multiple days and end up saving tracks each night, you can join them together when you get home. Tracks are flexible. So if you're just recording statistics, don't worry about what the GPS does in the field, you can clean it up later when you get home.

 

Now, from what I've read, on the Oregon 600 series, you can set the trip odometer to sync with the track collection. But you can also set it to be separate, as it is in the earlier GPS models. (I assume the same feature exists in the 64 series). Point is, on your 62, the trip odometer is different from the track. Use it to get an approximation of your distance travelled during the hike, but don't rely on it as the final say in the trip statistics. Remember, the odometer records wandering errors that you can remove from the track.

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Here's the problem I am having with this new unit....

 

Let's say bicycle from point A to B, 62s does great in recording the correct distance on the trip odometer. Then I turn off the GPS to go back to point A to record the ride stats

 

However the problem is when I turn back on the unit at point A, it's adding a straight line distance from point B to A almost doubling the distance on the trip odometer, making it quite a pain to use that feature.

 

This was not a problem with my Venture HC, Etrex 10, or Dakota 10.

 

I guess my question is has anyone else had this problem and if so, is there a selection setting on the 62s that would make the unit stop doing this.

 

Garmin 64s has the same problem and I went through 2 of them before giving up on the series. I had the latest firmware at the time (3.1) and that's what it would do. I would also fall into a wormhole: pedaling away from the car the odometer jumped from 10 FEET to 14 MILES! Another time I had recorded a maximum speed of 150+ MPH . . . on a bicycle! Lot of other oddities, but these were some of the most severe.

 

This was happening with two different units and your 62 shares a lot of the same design, so I'm willing to bet it is some "undocumented feature" :) Garmin has not fixed yet.

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It is 3) that I think we want, right?

 

Yes, it is #3 that we want except the trip odometer shouldn't default to zero (that should be our option). It should remain exactly the amount where we last turned off the unit. The Venture HC, Etrex Legend, Dakota 10, Edge touring, and yellow Etrex don't seem to have this problem. It seems to have introduced in the later Garmin series like the 62s and only showed up in the 62s after a certain firmware was introduced.

 

The 62s also suffers from the odometer moving when it's standing still, something the other units I mention seem to have under control.

 

Further Edit

 

Went on a bike ride today, used both the Venture HC and 62s..... Used a stop watch to determine my exact moving time... Watch had 58 minutes of moving time... Venture HC showed me moving 38 minutes and 39 seconds, while the 62s showed me moving 1 hour and 23 minutes... So the 62s doesn't know when it's not moving most of the time.... Then I got home, turned on the units, and allow both to get a fix.... Venture HC showed 10.02 miles before the fix and 10.03 miles after the fix... 62s had 10.41 miles before the fix and suddenly jumped to 39.27 miles after the fix with a moving MPH jumping by 4 fold also...

 

But it gets better, I allowed them to both sit still for a while, about 30 minutes, the Venture HC knew it had stopped and didn't calculate any more distance and didn't add any moving time.... While the 62s kept on piling on the mileage, having moved another 4/10th of a mile and adding on 23 minutes of moving time during the half hour. In other words, the 62s thought it was still moving most of the time.

 

The odometer feature and all moving MPH features on the 62s are horribly flawed and useless using the current firmware. It makes for a great geocaching unit but not a good hiking or cycling unit.

 

IT IS A BUG GARMIN, FIX IT

Edited by gpsblake
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@ Sussamb,You are absolutely correct.

All of the "PROBLEMS" posted above are totally explainable and are "User" caused and "User" correctable.

I posted a longer reply to your post #30 above but it was apparently censored and deleted by Forum "powers that be". It was there, then it wasn't! No explaination.

This one may suffer the same fate.

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I also recently bought a Garmin GPSMAP 62s and I am experiencing problems with the trip odometer. I reset the tracks so the odometer reads zero feet. Sometimes we wait 10 to 15 minutes before we start the hike and then trip odometer changes to as much as 2 tenths of mile before we even take a step. Is this normal? Defective unit? Is there something I can change in some buried menu to fix this problem?

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Nope. While you are standing there it is calculating new positions constantly and they add up. Two tenths is only 1000 feet and if it changes your position 20 feet each time it only takes 50 readings to get there. I don't clear tracks until the first step. Plus you are probably walking around talking and taking that last potty break.

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I would recommend just getting a bike computer. The GPS is not that accurate when it comes to recording distance traveled, especially when your course has few straight segments.

 

The "problem" that annoys me about the jump to the new fix is that the connecting track line is shown on the display. It doesn't annoy me enough to do any thing about it, though.

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Just like Strava and Map My Ride bicycle apps, if you don't stop the unit from recording at the end of the ride, you will get phony results. I forgot to turn off Strava at the end of a bike ride last week, got in my car and drove home. Guess what, my average bike ride speed was about 62 MPH! I wish! And the distance was way way off, because I didn't stop the recording at the end of the ride. I see that as operator error, not a bug.

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Just like Strava and Map My Ride bicycle apps, if you don't stop the unit from recording at the end of the ride, you will get phony results. I forgot to turn off Strava at the end of a bike ride last week, got in my car and drove home. Guess what, my average bike ride speed was about 62 MPH! I wish! And the distance was way way off, because I didn't stop the recording at the end of the ride. I see that as operator error, not a bug.

 

That's not the issue the OP is contending with. The OP is turning off his Garmin after the bike ride, but when he gets home, the Garmin locks a signal and connects the current point with the last known location and connects that with a straight line and a near instantaneous speed. The OP was using the trip computer to manually input his stats into a spreadsheet rather than connecting directly to the computer in Mass Storage mode and collecting stats from the track.

 

Of course, there's also the issue that the track stats and the trip computer stats don't always match up, and it's not always clear which is the more accurate read.

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Of course, there's also the issue that the track stats and the trip computer stats don't always match up, and it's not always clear which is the more accurate read.

Iv'e found that with the newer software I don't get as big a difference as in the past from the trip computer to the track log.

 

Garmin has a bug that makes the mileage wrong in the trip computer and track log. If you delete one point from the track log the mileage, ave speed etc will change. I believe this new mileage is correct or close to it. I have carried 2 different GPSs at the same time and got totally different mileages but after removing a point from each they will be close. When you remove the point the mileage might go up or down. Some times it's a small error some times it's a large error. I know this affect the GPSMAP 64s and etrex 20 so would assume it affects other Garmin GPSs.

 

Garmin has a case open on this.

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Of course, there's also the issue that the track stats and the trip computer stats don't always match up, and it's not always clear which is the more accurate read.

Iv'e found that with the newer software I don't get as big a difference as in the past from the trip computer to the track log.

 

Garmin has a bug that makes the mileage wrong in the trip computer and track log. If you delete one point from the track log the mileage, ave speed etc will change. I believe this new mileage is correct or close to it. I have carried 2 different GPSs at the same time and got totally different mileages but after removing a point from each they will be close. When you remove the point the mileage might go up or down. Some times it's a small error some times it's a large error. I know this affect the GPSMAP 64s and etrex 20 so would assume it affects other Garmin GPSs.

 

Garmin has a case open on this.

Is there a specific point to delete?

 

Typically, my tracks underestimate distance. I've always been suspicious that the trip odometer includes the effect of elevation on distance where the track log does not. Either that or distances reported on maps and trail signs are incorrect.

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Of course, there's also the issue that the track stats and the trip computer stats don't always match up, and it's not always clear which is the more accurate read.

Iv'e found that with the newer software I don't get as big a difference as in the past from the trip computer to the track log.

 

Garmin has a bug that makes the mileage wrong in the trip computer and track log. If you delete one point from the track log the mileage, ave speed etc will change. I believe this new mileage is correct or close to it. I have carried 2 different GPSs at the same time and got totally different mileages but after removing a point from each they will be close. When you remove the point the mileage might go up or down. Some times it's a small error some times it's a large error. I know this affect the GPSMAP 64s and etrex 20 so would assume it affects other Garmin GPSs.

 

Garmin has a case open on this.

Is there a specific point to delete?

 

Typically, my tracks underestimate distance. I've always been suspicious that the trip odometer includes the effect of elevation on distance where the track log does not. Either that or distances reported on maps and trail signs are incorrect.

 

You can delete any point in the track log using BaseCamp. If you don't want to delete a point you can open the track log in BaseCamp and click on the first point then hold shift and click on the next to last point or do the same thing on the second point and last point. It will then display the correct information.

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