Urban Geocaching and the Homeless encampments

[+brodiebunch]

I live in a medium sized city and work in a much larger city. For me, geocaching has become more challenging in larger city parks and public greenbelts because of the homeless encampments. I avoid those areas for the most part now for safety reasons.

 

Have other geocachers done the same or are not bothered by the encampments?

 

Just wondering.

[+Mudfrog]

I live in a medium sized city and work in a much larger city. For me, geocaching has become more challenging in larger city parks and public greenbelts because of the homeless encampments. I avoid those areas for the most part now for safety reasons.

 

Have other geocachers done the same or are not bothered by the encampments?

 

Just wondering.

I hate to come across homeless encampments,,, not because of safety, but because it's just sad to see people in these situations. I've been surprised a few times by the homeless but i've never run into any problems. The last time was a camp where i encountered a man bathing. Didn't seem to bother him any but at the same time, it's not something i want to run across again.

[+noncentric]

To the OP - I understand what you're referring to as I'm in your area.

 

I've come across some encampments in the greenbelts and in the parks. Once I see that 'following the arrow' will take me into such an area, then I'll generally just turn around and go look for another cache instead. I've even had such issues with 'parking lot' and 'bus stop' hides. Only on a couple of occasions have I actually searched while in such areas, but only because no one was home at the time. Ended up with DNF's and a conviction to not search such areas again, even if I'm with another person. It was just too uncomfortable for me.

 

This is not to say that all homeless folks are to be avoided, but there have been violent events (shootings, stabbing) in the more 'well-known' homeless areas around here and so I'd prefer to avoid being in such areas for my own personal safety. Many of the homeless areas are also littered with drug paraphernalia, broken glass, etc that I'd rather not be around while searching. With the above, I'm referring to the unsanctioned homeless areas that are common around my neck of the woods - under freeways, next to freeways, parks, greenbelts, picnic shelters, etc.

 

There are sanctioned homeless areas that I wouldn't be concerned about approaching. I haven't come across any of those while searching for a cache yet. With either area, I'd certainly not search if someone was watching me, but that's the same "muggle factor" that I'd contend with anywhere.

Edited February 24, 2017 by noncentric

[+CascadeHandmade]

There have been more and more encampments around my area too. I am concerned about safety mainly because I am a woman who sometimes caches alone. There have been recent local news stories about people being attacked/assaulted, so I actually have not been able to cache as often as I would like because nobody is available to accompany me.

 

I have been approached by a homeless person once or twice; but so far they have only politely asked for money and have not acted threatening - so far.

 

The part that makes me sad is when I find an abandoned homeless camp while I am out caching. It's always littered with trash, empty bottles and food wrappers, dirty discarded blankets and clothes, or stolen shopping carts. It frustrates me to see s beautiful part of the outdoors turned into a garbage dump. When possible, I try to clean up a little; but I am always worried there could be drug needles or something.

[+narcissa]

I have dealt with this a couple of times. I decided to archive because I figured the people staying there had enough to worry about without geocachers traipsing through their stuff.

 

I have an active cache that occasionally gets reports that make it sound like there's a shantytown next to it, but when I go to look it's like a piece of cardboard and a beer can on the ground. It's in a small wooded area next to a community centre and an apartment building near a major road, so while I wouldn't be shocked if someone slept there, a long-term camp set-up seems unlikely.

[+Team DEMP]

Only twice have I run into what appeared to be an area someone was taking up shelter. Both times I was alone and turned around and left, posting a note log on the cache page. Not sure if others before me came across the same situation and didn't post, but I would have appreciated if they did.

 

Growing up around the New York City area, homeless people or panhandlers aren't uncommon, but I somewhat expect to see them in the city vs out geocaching. By far the most aggressive homeless/panhandlers I've experienced have been in Vancouver, BC. I'm not sure if that aggressive behavior migrates down to where you are, but it was amazing how bold and persistent they were in the multiple times I visited.

[+Viajero Perdido]

They have bigger problems than we do, and for the most part they seem harmless to us game-players passing through. For the most part.

 

But I figure, regardless, it's best to avoid. The ideal spot to hide a cache - one with privacy - is also the ideal spot to hide a campsite. So for the most part, I've given up hiding in urban parks, and on the rare occasion I do, I look for a patch of ground that's steep, useless for pitching a tent.

 

Hey, why don't we all take the game out of the city and back into the wilderness, where it started?

[+Harry Dolphin]

I guess you'd have to define 'urban' as opposed to 'suburban' for me. I'm at the edge of rampant suburbia. The bridge people had to move when the rebuilt the bridge and made it unfriendly to the campers. I was considering hiding a cache in the tallus cave up the hill. But someone had been living there. One of the churches has a food day for needy people. That attracts the homeless. I've found old tents along the river across from the church. I have a cache near where a homeless person had been spotted staying, but the town trimmed the bushes to make it less private.

But I've seen homeless camps in unexpected places. How rural or urban does one consider Port Jervis, New York? Half mile out on the trail, along the river, there were five tents. Another one a mile north of town. The caches along the trail I went for. The one next to the tent north of town, I did not.

So, I see the homeless encampents as more suburban, than urban.

I have not seen homelesss camps in New York City, for example. But it's not unusual to see people washing clothes or bathing in public rest rooms. Oh, wait. I was geocaching (or was it benchmarking?) on the pave d trail between the FDR Drive and the East River and saw a very larg carton balanced on the railing between the highway and the trail. And it moved. I suspect someone was living/sleeping there.

[+cerberus1]

Hey, why don't we all take the game out of the city and back into the wilderness, where it started?

Was gonna ad in the violin froggy...

 

We've noticed more fridge-box camps in the last coupla years than earlier, and most seem to be small parks/wooded areas on the outskirts of towns.

I believe the reason is simple, it's where they can conveniently walk for supplies with little hassle from cops and older kids.

Anyone just needs to look at a major 24hr food chain's wooded areas out back (especially if a river/creek close by) and there's often a (tarp)tent city around.

 

Haven't seen any homeless camps out in the boonies, but after a few days, many backpackers look close.

 

A couple years ago, the other 2/3rds and I were fly fishing a stretch outside town, and noticed an entire family under an interstate bridge.

- These kinda folks I feel/fear for.

After the first fish offered to one of the youngsters, the smell of the campfire already crackling kept us determined to give 'em some fresh protein while there.

 

We haven't had any issues with the homeless yet.

Talking to a few, most didn't plan on being homeless, and have the same values as many of us.

- But we do remain observant (and usually armed) JIC.

 

Edited for my terrible spllellinng

Edited February 25, 2017 by cerberus1

[+dbrierley]

This archived, premium member geocache may have been intentionally placed near someone's encampment:

 

Well! Well! Well! What Do We Have Here?

 

When archiving it, the geocache owner changed the coordinates, changed the title to "A" and used a secondary account to adopt it away from his/her primary account.

[+noncentric]

Here is one of my Write Note logs for a cache that was in/near a homeless encampment: Log here. I heard, but didn't see, the people living there, but sounds like another cacher did about 6 months later.

 

Some of the homeless folks in the areas I've cached in have been a bit intimidating. In one instance, I was walking in a park with several cross-trails. Rectangular park with a trail along perimeter and multiple connecting trails, to get to the other side without walking all the way around the perimeter. I headed up the perimeter trail and planned to take a connecting trail, but there were 6-8 homeless folks sitting along both railings of the little footbridge over a creek. It wasn't a wide bridge and so I decided to continue on the perimeter trail and take the next connecting trail instead. I had only glanced down the connecting trail before walking straight on. I didn't turn toward the bridge, then turn around to go back to the perimeter trail. As I walked on, a couple of the people hollered the following at me: "that's right, just keep walking, you don't want to see us here, you don't want to help us with anything, just keep on walking you &*^#*". Not sure why I deserved that.

 

There are some homeless folks I recognize from seeing them day after day. Those that are by themselves, living out of their shopping carts, have seemed harmless and amicable. Although the one lady downtown that was always trying to hug people was annoying for someone that isn't a hugger. The folks that seem most threatening are those that hang out in groups, especially those that are intoxicated with alcohol and/or drugs. Unfortunately, there are many of the latter in my area.

 

Around here, there are many encampments in full view. There are some sections of downtown sidewalks that require stepping around sleeping bags, tents, garbage. I looked at some areas via Google Street View and it's astonishing how much some spots have changed in such a short time, for the worse. Some places that are full of tents and garbage now are empty in Street View images from only a year ago. It's no wonder our city has a homelessness "state of emergency". They've increased spending on the problem, yet the problem has gotten worse. It seems like they've failed to address the roots of the problem. Anyway, off my soapbox. Here are some views of where tents exist in our downtown area, although nowadays each of these areas has about 3x as many tents:

[+SeattleWayne]

I recognize those pictures.

[ohgood]

They have bigger problems than we do, and for the most part they seem harmless to us game-players passing through. For the most part.

 

But I figure, regardless, it's best to avoid. The ideal spot to hide a cache - one with privacy - is also the ideal spot to hide a campsite. So for the most part, I've given up hiding in urban parks, and on the rare occasion I do, I look for a patch of ground that's steep, useless for pitching a tent.

 

Hey, why don't we all take the game out of the city and back into the wilderness, where it started?

 

LOGIC !

 

yep, i usually won't take the kids with me to areas that might have tent cities or tons of blue cans (creek donkeys/rednecks/similar) littering the ground.

 

it's a lot nicer out and away from the easily accesible places, fewer micros, and fewer 'every 500 feet' placements.

[+JL_HSTRE]

I see homeless camps in suburban greenspace (parks and natural areas surrounded by housing) here in FL but so far not when the residents are home.

[+Corp Of Discovery]

True story: I was out caching with my son one day years ago when at one cache he said "Dad, you know this is the first cache we've found today that hasn't had a homeless camp nearby". Smart and observant that boy.

[+The Happy Hodag!]

There's a local puzzle cache here that had a homeless encampment right next to the final about 2 1/2 years go. If you want to check that story out, go here: https://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC1A6EE_virtually-famous-1 I'm sure I found the way in because of the homeless couple.

 

-The Happy Hodag!

[+briansnat]

Urban and suburban caches are often hidden in the sort of off the beaten path places that also attract the homeless. I've encountered plenty over the years. If it appears to be actively occupied I will move on.

 

Most recently I was placing a cache in a national park in a fairly large city. I found what I thought was the perfect spot until I noticed a bunch of sleeping bags nearby. I moved it away from there.

[+SeattleWayne]

 

 

LOGIC !

 

yep, i usually won't take the kids with me to areas that might have tent cities or tons of blue cans (creek donkeys/rednecks/similar) littering the ground.

 

it's a lot nicer out and away from the easily accesible places, fewer micros, and fewer 'every 500 feet' placements.

 

Hopefully homeless camps never get set up on power trails. I wouldn't like that at all.

[+hukilaulau]

I generally steer clear of caches near homeless camps, out of respect for the privacy of the residents.

twice, however, I have had a resident call out to me and, with a smile, point to where the cache was.

[+bflentje]

And here I thought we rid our society of the hungry, the homeless and poverty.. go figure

 

In all reality, I've run into homeless encampments in all three areas; urban, suburban and rural. But mostly urban. Each time I approach the situation on it's own merit. Some circumstances I will calmly go about my business. And some I will turn around and hightail it out of the area. Putting every scenario into the same bucket doesn't work for me.

[+SwineFlew]

They have bigger problems than we do, and for the most part they seem harmless to us game-players passing through. For the most part.

 

But I figure, regardless, it's best to avoid. The ideal spot to hide a cache - one with privacy - is also the ideal spot to hide a campsite. So for the most part, I've given up hiding in urban parks, and on the rare occasion I do, I look for a patch of ground that's steep, useless for pitching a tent.

 

Hey, why don't we all take the game out of the city and back into the wilderness, where it started?

 

Hey man, remember that homeless camp we ran into in Hong Kong? You went down to sign the cache and I stay up to keep them from seeing you. Fun time, fun time!!

[+PlantAKiss]

I'm often out alone in a large forest and I'm always concerned about coming up on a homeless person living out there. There is a chair someone sets up. I had a cop tell me homeless people set up camps in all kinds of wooded areas. There are a dozen or so caches in that forest.

[+DragonsWest]

I tend to retire caches which fall into encampments -

 

One, because many homeless have so much spare time to see something is being sought. Some have been very good about it, helping cachers, but others I expect have taken the containers for their personal use.

 

Two, because I don't want cachers disturbing these people, I recognize these are people in distress and most of them are wary of people coming around - what little they have the want to hold onto and some are very wary.

 

Three - there are some hardcore people on the street, they can be obnoxious and mean, they should be in institutions, but the states and federal government have turned them loose on the citizenry. Less than ideal all around.

[+SeattleWayne]

 

Three - there are some hardcore people on the street, they can be obnoxious and mean, they should be in institutions, but the states and federal government have turned them loose on the citizenry. Less than ideal all around.

 

We could just raise taxes to pay for their incarceration and treatment. I'm more than certain that'll help the problem. Oh wait.

[+DragonsWest]

 

Three - there are some hardcore people on the street, they can be obnoxious and mean, they should be in institutions, but the states and federal government have turned them loose on the citizenry. Less than ideal all around.

 

We could just raise taxes to pay for their incarceration and treatment. I'm more than certain that'll help the problem. Oh wait.

 

It did when we had it. There's probably an entire degree program on dealing with people who have lived on the street, the longer there the more difficult to get them off it (several programs are available for veterans, but the results have a declining rate of success over time)

 

There are the victims of the economy and there are those with substance/mental health issues. A better economy helps the former, but only institutions work with the latter. I see them all around my city, nobody can call these people lazy, it's hard work to live like that and the shelters are only for those who can and will follow the rules.

 

Anyway, I've been seeing more homeless over the past several years and expect the 2008/9 collapse brought a lot of that about. I don't see the situation changing by doing nothing about it.

[+noncentric]

Three - there are some hardcore people on the street, they can be obnoxious and mean, they should be in institutions, but the states and federal government have turned them loose on the citizenry. Less than ideal all around.

We could just raise taxes to pay for their incarceration and treatment. I'm more than certain that'll help the problem. Oh wait.

It did when we had it. There's probably an entire degree program on dealing with people who have lived on the street, the longer there the more difficult to get them off it (several programs are available for veterans, but the results have a declining rate of success over time)

 

There are the victims of the economy and there are those with substance/mental health issues. A better economy helps the former, but only institutions work with the latter. I see them all around my city, nobody can call these people lazy, it's hard work to live like that and the shelters are only for those who can and will follow the rules.

 

Anyway, I've been seeing more homeless over the past several years and expect the 2008/9 collapse brought a lot of that about. I don't see the situation changing by doing nothing about it.

I'm wondering if SeattleWayne's comment was in reference to local (Seattle) news about potentially raising property taxes to double the current ~$50MM spending to address homelessness. That would be $100MM to combat homelessness in the city and is admittedly not necessarily going to solve the problem. The last time the city doubled spending, the homeless population increased. Whether more money is really going to help is a big question here, especially since the city hasn't produced a complete plan of how that money will be spent. Shuffling homeless from the sidewalks to cordoned parking lots isn't really helping. They're still homeless, ill, addicted, unemployed, etc. Anyway, hopefully the city has learned what NOT to do from some of it's previous ideas. I think we may be veering off the subject of geocaching though.

[+DragonsWest]

Three - there are some hardcore people on the street, they can be obnoxious and mean, they should be in institutions, but the states and federal government have turned them loose on the citizenry. Less than ideal all around.

We could just raise taxes to pay for their incarceration and treatment. I'm more than certain that'll help the problem. Oh wait.

It did when we had it. There's probably an entire degree program on dealing with people who have lived on the street, the longer there the more difficult to get them off it (several programs are available for veterans, but the results have a declining rate of success over time)

 

There are the victims of the economy and there are those with substance/mental health issues. A better economy helps the former, but only institutions work with the latter. I see them all around my city, nobody can call these people lazy, it's hard work to live like that and the shelters are only for those who can and will follow the rules.

 

Anyway, I've been seeing more homeless over the past several years and expect the 2008/9 collapse brought a lot of that about. I don't see the situation changing by doing nothing about it.

I'm wondering if SeattleWayne's comment was in reference to local (Seattle) news about potentially raising property taxes to double the current ~$50MM spending to address homelessness. That would be $100MM to combat homelessness in the city and is admittedly not necessarily going to solve the problem. The last time the city doubled spending, the homeless population increased. Whether more money is really going to help is a big question here, especially since the city hasn't produced a complete plan of how that money will be spent. Shuffling homeless from the sidewalks to cordoned parking lots isn't really helping. They're still homeless, ill, addicted, unemployed, etc. Anyway, hopefully the city has learned what NOT to do from some of it's previous ideas. I think we may be veering off the subject of geocaching though.

 

At the risk of becoming fully off topic, I've seldom seen a problem go away by throwing money at it - since we are discussing people and lives here, bear in mind you can't institutionalize someone who doesn't want to be. I think there was a case in NYC which established that - people can be committed, but gone are the days of just picking up people who seem off kilter in some way and putting them in a facility and forcing well being onto them.

 

That said, it has been my observation that more than anyone else the homeless have time to sit and watch people going about their business, whether geocaching or otherwise. They can out-wait you and some are very, very cunning. You are not aware you are being observed. Best to not place caches nearby as risk their being acquired by new owners and best to more or archive those which are now camped upon.

[+Understandblue]

Sadly - this is one of the things that made me stop geocaching alone - which I used to really enjoy. We have giant parks and greenbelts here - and I was finding human waste, needles, large encampments and scary people more and more frequently and it just became frightening and unpleasant. I was happier worrying about coyotes and rattlesnakes. I enjoyed the hiking in more natural areas before it became a real problem - now I have to stick to urban trails to feel safe, and I've found most of the caches on the trails in my area. My brother in law doesn't get up as early as I do, or I'd hike with him more and feel better about it.