[The Jester]

jholly, on 11 April 2012 - 01:35 PM, said:

I'm wondering why the Hyundai Santa Fe did not make the list. Seems like it fits in the catagory, has good clearance, but the MPG is a bit down. Maybe that is it? Interesting thread, I will probably be geomobile shopping in a year to year and half so it is good reading at this time.

I started with a couple of "Top 10" lists I found online*, then knocked off those that started above $30K and those that listed less than 20 MPG. Then I looked at first five that were easy to get too... The Hundai wasn't on either of the Top 10 lists.

One thing I didn't think of when I started, was the size of the spare - full size or the small 'donut'?

BTW, the CRV 'hard' shell on the spare isn't really that hard, but more than clothe/rubber. It flexed quite a bit when we tried the bike rack, I wasn't sure how it would stand up to it. Though one advantage to the swing gate, you can open it with the bikes mounted, otherwise you need a lot more room around back to open it.


* reviewitonline.net - economy suv and small suv lists.

[Titus1919]

1982-1984 Toyota FJ40 Landcruiser

[John E Cache]

Considering the accident, do all the cars in the spreadsheet come with automatic breaking systems ABS. I grew up a flat lander in MN and thought I was a good snow driver until I moved out here. I slid down the road up to Saddle Mountain backwards. I'm wondering if ABS's help on the steep roads around here.

[hydnsek]

John E Cache, on 12 April 2012 - 10:41 PM, said:

Considering the accident, do all the cars in the spreadsheet come with automatic breaking systems ABS. I grew up a flat lander in MN and thought I was a good snow driver until I moved out here. I slid down the road up to Saddle Mountain backwards. I'm wondering if ABS's help on the steep roads around here.

I can't comment on ABS, but personally I think AWD/4WD is crucial for snow and ice. It's saved me several times. I don't think Jester's van had AWD, but i note all the vehicles on his spreadsheet do. A downside of AWD is slightly lower gas mileage, so the ability to switch 2WD/4WD might be an advantage.

This post has been edited by hydnsek: 12 April 2012 - 11:24 PM

[uxorious]

hydnsek, on 12 April 2012 - 11:22 PM, said:

John E Cache, on 12 April 2012 - 10:41 PM, said:

Considering the accident, do all the cars in the spreadsheet come with automatic breaking systems ABS. I grew up a flat lander in MN and thought I was a good snow driver until I moved out here. I slid down the road up to Saddle Mountain backwards. I'm wondering if ABS's help on the steep roads around here.

I can't comment on ABS, but personally I think AWD/4WD is crucial for snow and ice. It's saved me several times. I don't think Jester's van had AWD, but i note all the vehicles on his spreadsheet do. A downside of AWD is slightly lower gas mileage, so the ability to switch 2WD/4WD might be an advantage.

My understanding of 4WD and gas mileage is that the extra weight of the 4x equipment is why the mileage is different.

All the 4X4 vehicles I've had that you could switch from 2WD to 4WD, got worse mileage than the same vehicles with 2WD only. Although, I suppose the mileage would be even worse when you were in 4WD. I've never driven far enough with it on to check.


As for the ABS, I would not buy any vehicle that didn't have it. It makes a huge difference on snow, ice, gravel, or even just wet roads. ( didn't even know you could buy a newer vehicle without it.)

[The Jester]

ABS made no difference in the accident (yes, the van had it but the back end broke free and slewed the car around with no time to stop before I was over the edge).

I just drove home the new cache vehicle. We went with a manual tranny 2011 Subaru Forester. For those following along, this was my decision process:

Kia: While the backup sensors are a nice feature, the smaller load, the non-flat deck and the front piller blocking view of cars took it out of the running.

Honda: The load size and backup camera was very good, but the lower clearance pushed it to second place.

Subaru: The decent load, manual tranny, good clearance and flat deck moved it to top billing.

Toyota: The swing gate and rear tire/bike rack were too much negitive and overcame the cargo area seat release and load size.

Jeep: Price was great, clearance was the best, but the smaller back door, the headrest not fitting us and the small load took it off the list. With the Fredom Drive II it was more off-road vehicle than we needed.

If we hadn't found a used Forester, the CR-V was a close second - the manual tranny put it over the top. There was a 2009 Forester which we were also looking at, but the remaining warranty(s) were worth the couple of thousand more.

Thanks everyone for their input, recommendations and discussion. While I don't need the thread anymore, others may like to continue discussing various vehicles. Now if I can just get the GPSr back from Garmin so I can start using the vehicle...

[John E Cache]

The Jester, on 13 April 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

ABS made no difference in the accident (yes, the van had it but the back end broke free and slewed the car around with no time to stop before I was over the edge).

I just drove home the new cache vehicle. We went with a manual tranny 2011 Subaru Forester. For those following along, this was my decision process:

Thanks for the ABS info. The only time the ABS has been used on my Mini is when one wheel acts up just enough to trigger low tire indicator. Sounds like you done good with the Forester. I almost bought a Forester once. I went with a big Ford van for my windsurfers.

[k7-wave]

Just noticed this thread so I'm adding my congrats on the 2011 Forester. I was in the market a couple years back and test drove a Honda CRV, a Toyota RAV4 and a Forester. I chose the Forester (2010). The full-time 4WD only carries with it a 1 MPG penalty and it's sure nice to have. I get 24.0 MPG back and forth to work and got 28.5 MPG each direction driving to last year's WSGA Campout in Clarkston. The visibility of the Premium trim level with the moon roof is amazing, and was a main selling point for me. Mine is the auto tranny, sage green and I added the optional spoiler to set it apart in parking lots. Never regretted my choice. Enjoy!

[The Jester]

Just a note about recovery from the accident:

2002 Grand Caravan - replaced with 2011 Forester*
Palm M515 - replaced with the backup M515
Konica Camera - limping along with some functions sporatically working/not working, too old to repair
Cell phone - dried out and works fine (cheapest item - go figure)
Garmin 60CSx - replaced by Garmin with a refurbished unit for $110, with a map upgrade (as old one had maps unlocked for it) that included newest map data. Very cool!
Me personally - nary a bruise or sore muscle, but the 'nerves' needed a bit of overhaul/cool down.

BTW, we took the Forester up to the tulip fields around Mount Vernon last weekend - nice ride and handled the bike rack just fine. This weekend the fields should be even better (more tulips blooming).


*ETA: I found out that you can get car TB tags reprinted with the orginal number/code. Mine was magnetic and washed off in the river - a new one is on it's way.

This post has been edited by The Jester: 19 April 2012 - 04:33 PM

[Dgwphotos]

The Jester, on 19 April 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

Just a note about recovery from the accident:

Me personally - nary a bruise or sore muscle, but the 'nerves' needed a bit of overhaul/cool down.

I know the feeling! After a few minor accidents, if I'm riding in the car with my dad, and he's getting too close to other vehicles for my comfort level, I've been known to stomp on non existent brake pedals...

[lamoracke]

we were thinking of a new vehicle ourselves and saw the GMC Terrain as a car not mentioned anywhere here. Anyone ever had one of those to compare?

This post has been edited by lamoracke: 25 April 2012 - 10:16 PM

[The Jester]

lamoracke, on 25 April 2012 - 10:02 PM, said:

we were thinking of a new vehicle ourselves and saw the GMC Terrain as a car not mentioned anywhere here. Anyone ever had one of those to compare?

It was on the "Top 10" lists I linked earlier (#5 & #2) - good mileage, but slightly more expensive. It was lower on my list, and I never quite got to a dealership.

[lamoracke]

looks like the current 2012 Terrain is as follows
2.4L I-4 VVT direct injection (E85 capable) FWd 22 city/32 highway
AWd 20 city/29 highway
3.0L V-6 VVT direct injection (E85 capable) FWd 17 city/24 highway
AWd 16 city/23 highway

So, if AWD, would be 20/29 for I4 and 16/23 for V6.

The CR-V is an I-4 by default. Standard gas mileage is 23/31 by that is probably not AWD version...I think I have discovered the AWD version goes to 22/30.

So, the Terrain and CR-V both are about the same mileage for the non AWD versions but it would seem you and I both want AWD
Which in that case, according to their #s, its 20/29 for Terrain and 22/30 for CR-V.

So, probably a matter of cost where the CR-V is cheaper. As for us, we are going to see if we can find a slightly used Terrain and cost it, but the CR-V may be easier to find one more affordable.